This week on Growing with Proficiency The Podcast, part two of “All About Output” with Dr. Florencia Henshaw is out. Florencia discusses the importance of the process versus the product in writing, which can also apply to oral presentations. She also shares practical ideas on how we can use this process to help students become better communicators. Missed part 1? Listen here. We also delved into assessments and clarifying the goal of the output: is it about conveying a message or practicing language? First, we talked about the process of output versus the product itself.
Process vs Product
Dr. Henshaw and I discussed how we need to slow down when we’re talking about output and pay closer attention to the process. She explained that this idea of differentiating between product and process comes from writing. In second language writing, that’s the big shift. Often times, we say here’s the prompt, this is the number of words, go write it. Then, we grade it and are very focused on assessing the product. Sometimes, that is what you want. If that is entirely everything you’re doing, then you’re never really scaffolding or teaching the process of writing or the process of preparing a presentation. We should not assume that because you tell a student to write about something, that they will just go ahead and be able to do it.
Dr. Henshaw continued, “In the case of language learning, I think it makes more sense to focus much more on the process and how much we’re helping students get there as opposed to only doing the very traditional approach of “we covered the words, we covered the grammar, you practice, okay, now write the paragraph”, and then you assess and move on to the next chapter.”
Assuming What High Schoolers Know About Writing
I teach high school students, and I think that, often times, teachers assume that our language students learned how to organize ideas, how to create a comparison, etc. in previous courses and years. However, a lot of students did not learn that! The reality is that we assume that the students have all these skills that help them to become good writers, good communicators in general, and they haven’t. It’s really assuming, instead of modeling, and taking the time to really go over all these elements of a piece. Dr. Henshaw added to this that brainstorming is a great activity to do with students. She also added a few more ideas on this topic. Listen to episode 57 here to learn more.
Understanding Each Student’s Process
Next, we briefly discussed how not only do our students have their own writing process but so do we. Dr. Henshaw shared how she started off writing her book with just bullet points and expanded from there. She also believes that, for some students, it might be just that we give them the freedom at the beginning to not worry so much about the final product, but rather encourage them to just get some words out there. If they mix in some English for now, it’s okay. For some students, it’s about talking it out with somebody else. Let each student discover what works best for them. Dr. Henshaw also shared a few “next steps” after students start the writing process. Episode 57 has all the details.
Output Assessment & Feedback
I asked Dr. Henshaw about assessment and feedback for output. She started off by saying that we need to start valuing output for the sake of honing the skill of accessing the system of developing language, not necessarily assessing where they’re at through scores. It can give you a good idea of their skills, but not every form of output needs to be graded. The assessment could be how much their understanding is or how much they’re expressing, not necessarily always how much they’re expressing.
Remember to figure out why you are giving your students feedback. Also, there are limitations to feedback depending on what type you are providing. Dr. Henshaw explained, “If you’re the one giving them the answers and are simply circling and writing on top what the right word or form is, then all the student is doing is looking at it and then either tossing it in the trash or putting it in their backpack, and nothing happens with that type of feedback. I can almost guarantee you that was not worth your time.”
If the student is required to revise and the student has to be doing something with it relatively soon after getting the feedback, then that increases the chances that it could have an effect. But even then it’s not direct. Dr. Henshaw pointed out, ” For the majority of students, what most likely is going to happen is that it will be very, very temporary, in their working memory of, “Oh, that was wrong. This is the right one, okay, got it.” But, it’s no longer in their head. Ask yourself, “Is it worth my time?”
If you’re worried that if you don’t give feedback, the students are going to assume their papers are perfect. Dr. Henshaw can tell you, most likely your students are pretty aware that their papers are not perfect. You also need to be somewhat clear and consistent with the students. You cannot mark every error one time, and then the next time, you only mark a few.
One thing to ask yourself is, “Is this something that you would interrupt the student in class for?” Dr. Henshaw emphasized that, “I’ve never seen a teacher who is going to interrupt the student for every error they’re making when they’re talking in class.”
Dr. Henshaw gave a few things you can do for writing that you probably already do for conversations. One thing is to recast. Recast is when the student says something, and then you reformulate it and the conversation sort of keeps going. If a student says something incorrectly, you restate it correctly. If the student is ready to notice, they will notice it. They will notice the difference between what they said and what you’ve said. But, if they don’t, that’s okay. The work keeps going. So, for writing, if a student writes something incorrectly, instead of circling it and marking it wrong, you can rewrite it correctly in a statement and add a smiley face.
Another one that is perhaps more effective is a clarification request. That is when you pretend that you didn’t understand something because of the form a student uses. You’re drawing their attention to a specific form that carries a different meaning and therefore could be misunderstood. Dr. Henshaw points out that it’s more meaningful, and you’re still respecting the student’s message. You’re still saying that you care to understand what they said. Dr. Henshaw and I discussed a few more ways of how to make students aware of their errors. Listen to episode 57 for our whole conversation.
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